Comment l'investissement, le travail à la pige et les habitudes ont conduit au succès financier

Bienvenue au spectacle de podcast BiggerPockets Money 66 avec Paula Pant d’Afford Anything.

«Parce que quand tu n’as pas vraiment confiance en ta capacité de gagner, alors même quand tu vas bien, tu penses bien à ce succès que j’ai en ce moment, c’est juste un coup de chance ou c’est juste momentané. Si je pouvais le refaire, j’aurais simplement été plus confiant et les décisions qui en découleraient en auraient été le reflet. »

Le temps est venu pour un nouveau rêve américain, qui ne consiste pas à travailler dans une cabine pendant 40 ans, à peine à se frayer un chemin. Que vous cherchiez à mettre de l'ordre dans vos finances, à investir l'argent que vous avez déjà ou à découvrir de nouvelles voies pour créer de la richesse, vous êtes au bon endroit. Ce spectacle est pour quiconque a de l'argent ou en veut plus. C'est le podcast BiggerPockets Money.

Scott: Comment ça va tout le monde? Je suis Scott Trench. Je suis accompagnée de ma coanimatrice, Mme Mindy Jensen. Comment ça va aujourd'hui, Mindy?

Mindy: Scott, il fait très froid aujourd'hui à Denver, mais je vais très bien. Comment ça va aujourd'hui?

Scott: Je vais bien. C'est une interview fantastique avec Paul Pant, qui est vraiment l'une des superstars de l'ensemble du mouvement pour l'indépendance financière dans la région. Ce fut un réel privilège de pouvoir discuter avec elle aujourd'hui. Elle a un excellent spectacle et un programme sur Afford Anything. Nous vous encourageons vivement à vérifier cela pour un autre bon point de vue sur la façon dont ils peuvent gérer tout cela et ressembler à une discussion fantastique sur la frugalité, la productivité, le revenu.

Mindy: Tout.

Scott: La gestion de portefeuille, tout comme elle pense à la création de richesse et à la gestion de sa situation financière. Je parle de très peu de mines dans le monde aussi perfectionnées que la sienne à ce sujet, je pense.

Mindy: Je connais Paula depuis des années et nous évoluons dans les mêmes milieux et je n’ai jamais eu la chance de s’asseoir et de lui parler. Il y a quelques semaines, FinCon est venue à Denver et nous sommes toutes allées faire du ski. Elle était là et j'ai eu la chance de lui parler un peu. J'étais vraiment très enthousiaste de lui parler aujourd'hui parce que, comme vous l'avez dit, des grands noms dans cet espace et elle est tellement intelligente. Elle a juste… Comme à la fin du spectacle, je dis que j'ai appris comme 17 choses. J'ai appris au moins 17 choses de Paula et j'aime penser que je suis un peu informée sur tout ce qui touche l'argent, mais elle est comme, voici un conseil, voici un conseil, voici un conseil, voici un peu plus de connaissances, ici Il y a de très bonnes choses que vous pouvez faire et elle commence et repart pour, je ne sais même pas combien de temps le spectacle a duré, mais c'est incroyable. Chaque minute, vous devez écouter le tout.

Scott: Oui, je pense que c'est fantastique. Vous entendrez dire que c’est la première fois que vous allez en entendre parler. Nous changeons de nom et devenons Wider Pockets aujourd’hui, le 1er avril.

Mindy: Oh, tu as foiré l'introduction. Voulez-vous le refaire? Bienvenue sur le podcast Wider Pocket Money.

Scott: C'est vrai, j'aurais dû le faire.

Mindy: Bienvenue WiderPockets Money où nous vous apprenons…

Scott: Ceci est le spectacle de podcast WiderPockets Money.

Mindy: D'accord. Avant de faire venir Paula, écoutons une note du parrain de l’émission d’aujourd’hui.

Peu importe le type de propriété dans laquelle investir, il y a toujours un temps qui y passe. Des mois de planification, de travail et beaucoup d'argent. C'est pourquoi il est important de le protéger. Vous ne voulez pas qu'une conférence majeure après le vandalisme vous coûte des milliers de dollars. C'est pourquoi nous souhaitons vous informer de la sécurité à domicile SimpliSafe. Ces entreprises de sécurité traditionnelles compliquent la tâche de protéger votre maison ou votre propriété, mais pas SimpliSafe.

Il est complètement sans fil, pas de trous de forage et tous vos murs. Vous pouvez facilement vous déplacer entre les propriétés. Il continue de fonctionner si la puissance de ceux qui sont coupés, si le Wi-Fi est en panne ou si un cambrioleur casse votre clavier et qu'il n'y a pas de contrat. Nous ne sommes pas les seuls à penser que SimpliSafe est votre meilleur choix. SimpliSafe est un système de sécurité de premier choix chez CNET, PC Mag et plus de 3 millions de personnes. Rendez-vous simplement sur simplisafe.com/bpmoney pour en savoir plus. Commandez maintenant et obtenez leur garantie de remboursement de 60 jours. C'est SimpliSafe.com/bpmoney, SimpliSafe.com/bpmoney.

Prendre des risques financiers peut sembler logique à l’époque, mais quand ils se transforment en grosses erreurs, nous nous retrouvons stressés et brouillés. Être bon avec de l'argent et adhérer à des processus peut être difficile, surtout si vous dirigez une entreprise. Pour les propriétaires d'entreprise, il est important d'éviter les erreurs financières, car une solution de comptabilité simple telle que FreshBooks peut vous aider. FreshBooks est un logiciel de comptabilité en nuage qui garantit que vos finances sont bien suivies et organisées et que votre entreprise est conforme au moment de l'impôt. Voici comment FreshBooks aide. Premièrement, il vous permet de rester organisé avec un suivi du temps simple et intelligent pour vous et votre équipe. Deuxièmement, lorsque le moment est venu de collecter, vous pouvez créer et envoyer des factures très bien finies en environ 30 secondes ou moins.

Il vous permet d’enregistrer et d’organiser vos dépenses en appuyant simplement sur votre caméra mobile et vous permet de payer en un clin d’œil en acceptant les paiements par carte de crédit directement sur ces factures. Encore mieux, FreshBooks vous permet de rester en conformité avec les rapports utiles dont vous aurez besoin pour la saison des impôts. Nous proposons actuellement à nos auditeurs un essai gratuit de 30 jours de FreshBooks. Pas de carte de crédit nécessaire. Allez sur FreshBooks.com/bpmoney et entrez BiggerPockets Money dans la section comment avez-vous entendu parler de nous?

Mindy: Très bien, merci au sponsor d’aujourd’hui. Maintenant, sans plus tarder, Paula Pant d’Afford Anything. Bienvenue sur le podcast BiggerPockets Money, comment allez-vous aujourd'hui?

Paula: Je suis fantastique. Merci de m'avoir invité ici.

Mindy: Je suis tellement content que tu sois là. Comment allez vous?

Paula: Je suis génial. C'est un bon matin. J'ai cette routine matinale dans laquelle je fais une tasse de café et que j'écris dans mon journal. J'ai deux journaux différents, l'un dans lequel je sorte de flux de conscience et l'autre est un journal de gratitude. Je commence la matinée avec cela et cela me prépare complètement pour la journée.

Scott: Eh bien, à quoi êtes-vous reconnaissant aujourd'hui?

Paula: Je suis reconnaissant d'avoir, c'est ce que j'ai écrit ce matin, d'avoir beaucoup d'amis. Comme hier soir, nous enregistrions un lundi matin et hier soir, dimanche soir. J'avais deux invitations différentes à passer du temps avec des amis le dimanche soir. L'un était un dîner et l'autre était un film auquel beaucoup de gens allaient. Ayant cela, comme savoir que je suis connecté à une communauté, j'en étais reconnaissant, reconnaissant pour le café, reconnaissant pour le soleil, reconnaissant pour le fait que les affaires vont bien et la santé. En fait, j'ai aussi écrit pour les pantalons de survêtement. J'aime beaucoup les pantalons de survêtement. Ils sont confortables. Je veux dire, pourquoi ne leur seriez-vous pas reconnaissant?

Mindy: Je suis également très reconnaissant pour le café chaque matin. Parfois, c'est comme si je me couchais, le matin, je peux prendre un café.

Paula: Mon meilleur ami a dit celui-là. Elle m'a dit qu'elle se réveillait et que les premières pensées qui traversaient son esprit étaient: je suis réveillé. Je pourrais manger du pain grillé.

Mindy: Je dirai que je ne suis pas aussi reconnaissant pour le pain grillé que pour le café. Le café est mon préféré. D'accord, au lieu de l'histoire de BiggerPockets Money aujourd'hui, nous allons simplement parler de BiggerPockets Coffee.

Scott: Non, je pense que c'est un bon point parce que je fais la même chose tous les matins, non? Là où j’ai mon petit, ce n’est pas un journal, j’imprime une feuille de papier et j’écris trois choses pour lesquelles je suis reconnaissant chaque matin. Je pense simplement que cela ressemble à un drôle de chevauchement et que c’est un excellent moyen, non seulement d’avoir une journée plus heureuse, mais plutôt un peu comme un outil de productivité. Vous commencez la journée, je me sens bien avec les choses.

Paula: Absolument… De quoi êtes-vous reconnaissant ce matin?

Scott: J'ai dit que j'étais reconnaissant pour ma merveilleuse petite amie, Virginia. Je suis reconnaissant à notre équipe formidable ici à BiggerPockets et je suis reconnaissant que la température se réchauffe plus tard dans la semaine car il fait terriblement froid aujourd'hui. C'est un peu comme un cri inversé.

Paula: Une gratitude en retour.

Mindy: Je pense que c’est vraiment important que vous soyez tous les deux des personnes extrêmement performantes et que vous écriviez tous les deux ce pour quoi vous êtes reconnaissant, et j’ai vu le petit article de Scott parler de ses objectifs et de sa manière générale de gérer ma vie de papier. Scott, nous devrions faire un lien vers cela dans les notes de spectacle parce que c'est vraiment très utile. En fait, je ne fais pas ça. Je me sens vraiment débordé en ce moment dans ma vie. Le mois de février est toujours mon mois le plus occupé et, grâce à Dieu, il est terminé. Nous enregistrons cela en mars maintenant et ce n’est plus le mois de février et je peux à nouveau respirer à nouveau. Bien sûr, c’est à ce moment que l’immeuble locatif idéal est apparu au coin de chez moi et que je ne pouvais tout simplement pas y arriver.

Je n'ai pas l'espace mental, mais cela semble être une façon très intéressante de commencer une journée et ce sont les choses pour lesquelles je suis reconnaissant. Je suis très reconnaissant d'avoir des enfants en bonne santé, j'ai vraiment des enfants en bonne santé. La fille d’un ami s’est cassé le bras à quatre endroits, cela ne semble pas être une expérience amusante. Je suis si heureux de ne pas avoir eu cette expérience. Je devrais commencer à les écrire plus souvent, comme chaque jour sonne bien. Merci, je suis reconnaissant d’avoir parlé à Paula ce matin et à Scott, et j’ai une nouvelle chose à faire pour commencer ma matinée.

Paula: Ah, c'est génial.

Mindy: Oui. Je l'entends encore et encore. J'ai juste besoin de le faire. Voilà, conseil pro pour tout le monde aujourd'hui. Y a-t-il quelque chose que vous entendez sans cesse, que vous devriez faire et que vous savez que vous devriez le faire mais que vous ne le faites pas, faites-le. Écrivez maintenant, commencez aujourd'hui.

Paula: Je vais ajouter à cela. Une chose qui a aidé, je pense que tous les auditeurs pourraient en bénéficier, est cette notion appelée empilement d'habitudes. C’est ce concept selon lequel, s’il existe une habitude que vous avez déjà et que vous souhaitez créer une nouvelle habitude, liez l’habit déjà existant à la nouvelle. Par exemple, je bois une tasse de café tous les matins, c’est une habitude et je n’oublierai jamais de le faire. Il y a 0% de chances que j'oublie de boire une tasse de café le matin. Lorsque je voulais commencer à noter par habitude et par habitude la gratitude, je la relie à ma tasse de café. Je fais une tasse de café puis je m'assieds et je journalise. Je dirai même qu'il y a eu des moments où, la semaine dernière, je voyageais, j'étais à Los Angeles, et pour différentes raisons dues à des changements de routine.

Cela semble affreux, mais il y avait quelques matinées où je ne buvais pas de café et c’était ces matinées que je n’écrivais aucune gratitude. C’est une façon de s’assurer que votre nouvelle habitude de développer des bâtons est de laisser l’habitude existante être le repère ou le déclencheur qui mène à la suivante.

Scott: Pendant que nous sommes sur ce sujet, avez-vous autre chose? Comme si vous réalisiez un journal de conscience et un journal de gratitude, ces liens renvoient-ils à quoi que ce soit autour de vos objectifs que vous essayez de travailler?

Paula: Non, pas du tout. Je laisse juste le courant de conscience un, je le laisse juste couler librement. Le flux de conscience un, en fait, j’utilise un agenda et il y a un espace vide pour chaque jour et cela limite la quantité que je peux écrire. J'aime ça définit le conteneur. Je ne peux pas exagérer et passer 45 minutes à écrire parce qu'il n'y a pas assez de place pour la journée. En même temps, je ne vais pas écrire trop peu parce que je ressens le besoin de remplir l’espace alloué pour la journée. En utilisant un agenda, on me dit que ces paramètres sont exactement ce que j’écris pour aujourd’hui et qu’il n’ya pas de plan en ce sens. Tout ce qui sort du stylo est ce qui sort du stylo.

Mindy: Faites-vous quelque chose avec ce journal de flux de conscience? Cela se transforme-t-il parfois en articles de blog ou en idées de salon ou quelque chose du genre ou est-ce que cela vous libère de l'espace?

Paula: C'est une très bonne question. Celui que j'écris au stylo et au papier, non, je ne fais rien. Cela ne se développe pas. C'est purement pour moi. Mais je le fais si je voulais écrire des articles de blog. C’est quelque chose qui est une réalisation très importante que j’ai eu au cours de la dernière année. J'avais l'habitude d'essayer d'écrire des billets de blog de la manière que la plupart des gens vous apprennent à le faire, ce qui est aussi incroyable que le fait d'enquêter sur ce que votre public veut, puis de le lui donner. Découvrez leurs questions ou recherchez des mots-clés, puis écrivez-y. Lorsque j'ai essayé de suivre cette approche, j'ai constaté que je n'écrivais pas d'un lieu d'inspiration ou d'authenticité et que je commençais tout juste à me sentir comme un boulot et que je n'aimais pas le travail et que je ne voulais pas le faire et le faire… Bon? Ensuite, j'ai commencé à écrire Stream of Consciousness sur mon ordinateur portable sans but particulier.

Quand je le fais sur un ordinateur portable, je découvris que je tombais souvent sur des idées qui pourraient être développées dans des articles de blogues. Celles-ci étaient bien plus authentiques et inspirées et résonnaient ainsi avec plus de monde. Ils ne sont pas optimisés par mots clés, ils ne sont pas basés sur des données d'enquête, mais parce qu'ils sont du cœur, ils se connectent avec plus de gens et je pense qu'ils ont un impact plus important. Comme par ironie, ils ont un impact plus important car ils n'essayent pas d'avoir un impact plus important.

Mindy: C'est juste là, c'est de l'or pur. Si vous êtes un blogueur, écrivez-le, car oui, lorsque vous essayez d'écrire sur un mot clé, il apparaît aussi authentique qu'un mot génial, il est aussi très inauthentique que d'essayer de remplir le formulaire pour obtenir la plupart des vues. D'accord, normalement, nous vous demandons de nous indiquer où commence votre voyage avec de l'argent, mais c'est fantastique. Promenez-nous dans votre matinée. J'aime le conseil de prendre votre habitude actuelle, qui est de boire du café, et vous ne faites que boire du café. Je peux écrire dans un journal pendant que je bois du café, ce sont deux choses qui peuvent être reliées.

Paula: Oui absolument. Ce conseil est venu d'un écrivain du nom de James Clear qui a écrit un livre intitulé Atomic Habits. Il vient en fait de deux personnes, James Clear et Charles Duhigg, qui a écrit The Power of Habits. Cela découle de ces deux livres et ce sont deux livres formidables. Pour ceux qui écoutent, je les recommande tous les deux. Mais ils insistent beaucoup sur le fait qu’une habitude est fondamentalement une cue-action-récompense. Que vous essayiez de créer une nouvelle habitude ou de casser une mauvaise habitude, divisez-la en ces trois éléments. Qu'est-ce que les files d'attente? Quelle est l'action? Quelle est la récompense? Dans le cas de Charles Duhigg, il a constaté que la file d’attente était que tous les jours, vers 3 h 30, il se trouvait à son bureau et commençait à peine à s’ennuyer ou à se sentir agité.

Ses files d'attente étaient le temps, l'emplacement et l'état émotionnel. Il était 3 h 30, le lieu était un bureau, l'état émotionnel était l'ennui, c'étaient les files d'attente. Il a ensuite agi en mangeant un biscuit aux pépites de chocolat. Ensuite, la récompense a été ce bref coup de dopamine que vous obtenez lorsque vous mangez un biscuit aux pépites de chocolat. Bien que, finalement, c’était une mauvaise habitude parce qu’il commençait à prendre du poids avec tous ces biscuits aux pépites de chocolat. Une fois qu’il a pu prendre cette habitude de biscuit aux pépites de chocolat qu’il avait et le décomposer en ce niveau granulaire, il a ensuite gardé les mêmes files d’attente. Les files d'attente étaient inévitables, non? ça va toujours être 15h30.

Il va être à son bureau, il va s'ennuyer et il a gardé la même récompense qui était ce coup de dopamine dans son cerveau et a trouvé une action différente qui mènerait de A à B. Dans son cas, tous les jours à 15h30, il s'autorisa à se lever de son bureau, à se promener, à discuter avec des collègues, à sortir s'il faisait beau ou s'il faisait beau. Comme s'il s'était donné la permission de prendre cette pause, il a toujours cette récompense sans le cookie.

Scott: Comment ces habitudes ont-elles eu un impact sur votre réussite? Comme quelles sont certaines des autres habitudes que vous avez peut-être en dehors de l'écriture?

Paula: Je tiens à dire que je ne veux nullement dire que je suis excellent dans ce domaine ou que je suis extrêmement imparfait, mais il y a eu de nombreuses fois dans ma vie des habitudes ou des habitudes temporairement formées qui m'ont bien servi. La méditation en est une avec laquelle j'ai été de temps en temps. Le yoga est un sport avec lequel j'ai souvent travaillé. Je me suis rendu compte que, pour écouter cela, les gens pourraient penser attendre un instant, vous venez de poser des questions sur le succès. Ma réponse ne devrait pas être de claquer sur un ordinateur portable ou de regarder à travers les déclarations de résultat, honnêtement, mais vraiment, ces éléments d'un mode de vie sain sont énormes. Je crois que c'est la pierre angulaire de la productivité. Il y a dix ou quinze ans, il était à la mode pour les gens de croire qu'ils étaient des robots et d'essayer de les maîtriser ou de les propulser.

Pensez si je peux juste ne pas dormir, n'est-ce pas? Si je me lève tôt, que je travaille tard et que je me sens mal, cela signifie que je réussirai. Mais vraiment, si vous essayez cela, vous obtiendrez des rendements décroissants. Vous êtes peut-être assis devant un ordinateur portable, mais votre esprit n'y est pas, votre esprit n'est pas concentré. Les gens blâment souvent les médias sociaux ou Internet pour leur distraction, mais la réalité est antérieure à ce que les médias sociaux ou Internet existent, les gens sont toujours divisés en zones. Les gens étaient toujours assis à leur bureau et avaient construit une chaîne de trombones ou vous souvenez-vous de l'époque où le papier de l'imprimante avait ces deux côtés? Comme les petits côtés que vous auriez à détacher de chaque feuille de papier pour imprimante et ensuite vous pourriez en faire de petits dessins. Vous pouvez plier les uns sur les autres et créer de petits motifs d'origami? D'accord, toute personne de moins de 30 ans n'a aucune idée de ce dont je parle mais…

Mindy: Oui, je pense à moi-même, je ne pense pas que Paula est assez vieille pour se souvenir de l’imprimante matricielle?

Paula: Je suis juste assez vieux. Comme si tu avais 35 ans, c’était comme un souvenir de petite enfance.

Scott: Je pense aussi que nous voulons en venir au fait que, comme dans le monde d’aujourd’hui, comme je me souviens de mon enfance, n’est-ce pas? Il n'y avait pas toute cette électronique partout. Comme chaque moment de réveil, maintenant adulte, je peux être diverti, éduquer, apprendre ou faire quelque chose en tout temps. En fait, si je fais la queue à un endroit, je peux faire quelque chose. Comme auparavant, il y avait des périodes d'ennui. Cela va se remplir de ce genre de choses qui, à mon avis, sont en quelque sorte ce que j'entends.

Paula: Droite. Oui, c'est aussi un bon point. Il y a un écrivain du nom de Cal Newport qui a écrit un livre intitulé Deep… Il a écrit de nombreux livres mais le livre intitulé (inaudible) (18:02) est celui qu'il parle de ce concept. Afin de se concentrer, il est important de saisir ces moments de ces petits moments d’ennui. Par exemple, lorsque vous faites la queue à l'épicerie plutôt que de vérifier votre téléphone, soyez en ligne et remarquez. Comme faire attention à votre environnement, notez les personnes autour de vous. Lorsque vous êtes à la porte d’un aéroport attendant que votre zone soit appelée, ne vous connectez pas. Asseyez-vous à la porte et regardez les gens. Lorsque vous appuyez sur le bouton de l'ascenseur et que vous attendez que celui-ci apparaisse, n'utilisez pas votre téléphone. Attendez que l'ascenseur apparaisse.

En adoptant ces petits moments d’ennui, le premier, il n’ya pas de véritable perte de productivité que vous allez subir. Comme de façon réaliste, combien de travail allez-vous faire entre le moment où vous appuyez sur le bouton d'ascenseur et celui où l'ascenseur apparaît? Rien. Mais en embrassant ces petits moments d’ennui, faute d’un meilleur mot, vous entraînez votre esprit à mieux se concentrer, à ne pas sauter constamment de stimulus divertissants à stimulants divertissants. En conséquence, c’est vraiment une habitude qui vous permet de vous concentrer plus longtemps, ce qui vous permet de faire le travail en profondeur nécessaire pour exceller dans votre profession, que cette profession soit d’écriture ou, pour la plupart des auditeurs. Je suis sûr que les gens exercent toutes sortes de professions qui impliquent de scruter une feuille de calcul pendant une longue période ou de lire un document dense pendant une longue période ou tout ce que vous devez faire pour que vous puissiez exceller dans votre travail. . Cette chose implique probablement une profonde concentration. Vous devez faire preuve de concentration en tant que pratique.

Mindy: Oui, c'est bon de s'ennuyer. Je pense que je riais quand Scott a dit, quand j'étais enfant, il n'y avait pas toutes ces choses électroniques. Quand j'étais enfant, il n'y avait même pas d'internet. Je me souviens d'avoir eu le premier système Atari et c'était tellement cool. J'ai eu Pong, comme le réel avec les boutons et vous ne savez probablement même pas ce que c'est, Scott. Mais oui, il n'y avait pas tout ça. Vous venez de trouver d'autres moyens de vous occuper. Nous courions dans la rue, jouions avec nos amis ou restions à l'extérieur, ou simplement regardions l'herbe ou s'allongions sur le dos et levions les yeux au ciel pour voir les nuages ​​et celui qui ressemble à une baleine et qui peut s'ennuyer car c’est à ce moment que votre créativité prend le dessus.

J'aime votre citation, il n'y a pas de perte de productivité en ne vous connectant pas au téléphone entre le moment où vous appuyez sur le bouton de l'ascenseur et l'ouverture de la porte. Vous avez raison, je ne négocie pas d’ententes de plusieurs millions de dollars dans un délai de quatre secondes ou de trois minutes s’il s’agit d’un très long trajet en ascenseur. Mais c'est un très bon point. J'aime ça, j'ai beaucoup aimé ça.

Paula: Oui, absolument. Parfois, il y a cette productivité factice où vous vous sentez productif parce que vous répondez à un tweet ou désabonnez-vous d'un courrier indésirable qui encombre votre boîte de réception. Il peut être tentant de penser, eh bien, j’ai fait des progrès graduels et je suis donc productif. Mais vraiment ce que vous faites est un travail en profondeur. Concentrez-vous sur ce 80-20 de Quelles sont les quelques choses que vous pouvez faire qui donneront des résultats démesurés? Vous pouvez alors consacrer une heure de votre journée à répondre aux tweets ou à nettoyer votre boîte de réception. Absolument, cela doit être fait, mais ne vous y perdez pas si bien que vous confondez le travail chargé avec la productivité réelle.

Mindy: Alex a une petite plaque sur son bureau. Il dit: «Ne soyez pas occupé, soyez productif."

Paula: Dans la même veine, ne soyez pas occupé, soyez productif, je pense que beaucoup de gens ont aussi ce sentiment de fausse frugalité. En ce qui me concerne, lorsque je cherchais de l'argent, que j'apprenais à quoi ressemblait le monde de l'argent, dans mes premières années, j'étais vraiment prise dans ce que j'appellerais maintenant avec le recul une fausse frugalité. La fausse frugalité consiste à penser que vous êtes frugal mais que vous perdez vraiment du temps. Par exemple, si je voudrais examiner de plus près où vos bananes coûtent 30 cents la livre moins cher dans cette épicerie que dans cette autre épicerie, le lait coûte 50 cents moins cher dans cette épicerie que dans cette autre. Comme si je pensais à moi-même que j'étais frugal en poursuivant ces minuscules petits sous ou en passant des heures à scruter les plus petites choses alors qu'en réalité je perdais en réalité une heure en économisant 2 dollars.

En fait, cette fois, j'ai littéralement perdu une heure pour économiser 3,60 $. J'achetais quelque chose qui coûtait 100 $. C'était une fenêtre pour un bien locatif ou pas de porte, ou c'était quelque chose d'un bien locatif. Je pense qu'une fenêtre ou une porte ou autre chose, ça n'a pas d'importance. Cela coûte 100 $ et j’ai appelé cette petite boutique familiale où je l’achetais et j’ai essayé de faire un paiement par téléphone et ils m'ont dit, si vous effectuez ce paiement par carte de crédit, c’est ce que je ferais si effectué le paiement par téléphone, nous vous facturerons un supplément de 3%. Mais si vous pouvez écrire un chèque ou payer en espèces, il n'y a pas de supplément. Dans mon esprit, j'étais cool, je peux éviter un supplément de 3% si je conduisais juste 20 minutes là-bas, payais par chèque puis me rendais 20 minutes en arrière.

Ce n’est que plus tard que j’ai réalisé que c’était une fausse frugalité, car 20 minutes en voiture, puis 20 minutes pour traiter la transaction, puis 20 minutes en arrière, c’est une heure de mon temps et un supplément de 3% sur un achat de 100 $ valait 3 $ . Je viens de perdre une heure de mon temps pour économiser 3 $. J'ai fait le calcul et cela a fonctionné à 3,60 $ exactement ce que j'ai économisé. C’est un exemple parfait de fausse frugalité que j’ai fait si souvent quand j’étais plus jeune. Je pense que cela découle vraiment d'un lieu d'insécurité car, fondamentalement, je ne croyais pas que mon temps valait très bien. Lorsque votre temps ne vaut rien, le consacrer à un sou penny semble être un choix rationnel, car si vous ne croyez pas profondément en votre capacité à gagner plus et à avancer, vous voudrez bien sûr gagner de l'argent. au fond. Avec le recul, la fausse frugalité, la fausse productivité, tout cela est tiré du même tissu, pour ainsi dire.

Mindy: C'est vraiment très important que vous disiez que vous ne pensiez pas que votre temps valait de l'argent. Je fais beaucoup de cure de désintoxication chez moi et avec mon mari. Ce que j’entends encore et encore, c’est que votre temps pourrait être mieux dépensé. Eh bien oui et non. Cela dépend de ce que je fais et de ce que cela va coûter par rapport à ce que cela me coûte de faire. Mais c'est vraiment, vraiment important. Votre temps a une valeur parce que votre temps est limité. Vous n’avez que 24 heures par jour, je n’ai pas encore trouvé l’échappatoire qui vous donne plus que cela. J'en ai besoin, mais c'est le seul montant que vous avez. La fausse frugalité, c'est vraiment drôle.

Je l'ai fait avec le prix du gaz. Je traverserais la ville en voiture pour économiser 2 cents sur un gallon d'essence jusqu'au jour où j'aurais enfin compris qu'il me restait environ 10 gallons de carburant dans ma voiture et que je venais d'économiser 2 dollars en traversant la ville. Je me suis assis dans tous les feux rouges et je suis resté assis là et j'ai été frustré. Pourquoi cela prend-il si longtemps et 2 dollars? Non non Non. C'est à 20 cents.

Paula: Non, c'est 20 cents.

Mindy: 20 cents ça coute. Où que je sois, je ne fais même pas attention au coût de l’essence. J'ai besoin d'essence, ce n'est pas comme si je pouvais m'en passer. Ma voiture ne fonctionnera pas avec des pelures de banane ni avec ce qu'ils ont fait dans la troisième partie de Back to the Future. Elle ne fonctionne qu'avec de l'essence. Je me rends donc à la station-service et la mets dedans, et ainsi de suite, car mon temps vaut plus de 20 cents. .

Paula: Tout d’abord, il ya une troisième partie de Retour vers le futur.

Mindy: Oui, c'est une trilogie.

Paula: Quoi? Deuxièmement, il est amusant que vous donniez cet exemple de station-service, car littéralement, l’autre jour, j’ai suivi exactement ce processus de réflexion. Mais pour moi, les deux stations d'essence n'étaient pas de l'autre côté de la ville, mais de l'autre côté de la rue. Parce que vous savez comment ils construisent souvent des stations-service concurrentes à la même intersection. J'étais à une intersection, je suis entré dans une station, j'ai regardé de l'autre côté de la rue et j'ai remarqué que la station en face avait de l'essence qui coûtait 2 cents le gallon moins cher et j'avais déjà réfléchi, j'avais déjà garé ma voiture à un poste d'essence. Pompe, je pensais retourner dans ma voiture, démarrer la voiture, s’éloigner de la pompe et traverser la rue, puis j’ai réalisé que c’était 20 cents. J'ai pris la décision consciente de ne pas le faire.

Mindy: Oui. Quand je rencontre ceux-ci aussi, je décide d'accord lequel je ne dois pas faire un virage à gauche? Je me fiche de combien coûte l'essence. Je ne veux pas tourner à gauche. Désolé, nous continuons à marcher sur Scott.

Scott: Non, je veux juste préciser ce que je pense de… Parce que je me souviens d’il ya deux ans, j’avais vécu le même genre de choses. Comme combien vaut mon temps et où doit-il être dépensé? Ce que la valeur en dollars de mon temps et de mon goût comprend, c’est un chiffre fluide. Comme ce nombre est inférieur pour vous, non? Vous devriez passer plus de temps à économiser de l’argent ou à travailler des heures supplémentaires, peu importe ce que c’est quand votre temps est moins précieux et que vous passez à la liberté financière, votre temps, au sens financier du terme, devient plus précieux, non? Parce que vous pouvez commander plus de revenus, vous avez plus de revenus provenant d'actifs passifs, etc. Comment pensez-vous cela et comment cela a-t-il évolué avec le temps?

Paula: C'est une très bonne question. Une chose avec laquelle j'ai beaucoup lutté, c'est que quand je suis honnête avec moi-même, je vois toutes mes inefficacités. Je peux voir tous les moments où je suis en train de zoner. Je vois tous les moments, je ne regarde pas nécessairement la télévision ni aucun de ces exemples que les gens chérissent souvent comme une perte de temps, mais je vais quand même passer beaucoup trop de temps. Je vais passer cinq minutes supplémentaires sous la douche au-delà de ce qui est nécessaire, à proprement parler. Ou je vais passer un peu trop de temps à m'habiller ou je vais simplement m'éloigner et me laisser distraire, puis 15 minutes se sont écoulées. Pendant longtemps, j'ai eu beaucoup de mal à sous-traiter. Je le fais toujours, pour être honnête, je lutte toujours avec cela tous les jours.

Il est très difficile d'externaliser des choses, mais très difficilement, car je penserais à moi-même, eh bien, si je pouvais simplement améliorer ma productivité, je pourrais le faire. tout. Si je dis non à ce poste ou si je dis non à cette opportunité génératrice de revenus, est-ce que j'y vais réellement ou si je sous-traite et épargne quelques heures, vais-je réellement passer ce temps à travailler pour générer des revenus ou mon nombre de les heures de travail restent les mêmes mais maintenant je ne fais que payer un supplément? Le meilleur conseil que j'ai trouvé à ce propos vient d'un auteur du nom de Laura Vanderkam à qui elle a fait cette suggestion. Elle a déclaré: «Tout d’abord, remplissez votre emploi du temps avec tout ce qui ne peut pas être sous-traité, qu’il génère ou non un revenu."

Par exemple, appelez votre mère. Vous ne pouvez pas payer quelqu'un pour appeler votre mère en votre nom, non? Exercer, autant que vous le souhaitez, vous ne pouvez pas payer quelqu'un pour exercer en votre nom. Remplissez d'abord votre emploi du temps avec toutes ces choses, puis s'il reste du temps, remplissez votre emploi du temps avec les tâches pouvant être externalisées. Mais je pensais que le cadre était bien meilleur que celui-ci si je sous-traitais deux heures, puis-je alors les remplacer par deux heures rémunératrices? Because maybe the answer is no, I am not going to replace those with two income producing hours but I will spend those two hours working out and talking on the phone with my parents and those are far more valuable.

Mindy: That is really powerful. I am thinking, as you are saying this, I am thinking to myself spend time with my kids. I cannot really outsource that. I mean I can. I can have somebody watch my kids, but then I am not getting the interaction with them that I want to have and exercise always gets pushed to the back corner.

Paula: Droite? Exactly, exactly. Those are the unique things that only you can do. Like somebody else can mow the lawn, somebody else can scrub the inside of the oven. Although apparently ovens or self-cleaning now, I have just learned that, but somebody else can do those things but only you can have the emotional heart to heart conversation with the people that you love. Yes, only you can lift weights, nobody else can do that for you.

Scott: No, I love it. I think that like this is fundamental to kind of building a scaling infrastructure for your time management, right? Which is directly correlated to your other goals in life, right? Including your financial goals and all that kind of stuff, right? Like absolutely right. You have to exercise, you have to have relationships with the ones that you love and put the time into those things. But then like within the rest of that bucket, right? Those things that can be outsourced that duke you can place a dollar value on, right? Like, I do not know, painting a rental property, right? One of the great things about this business of rental property investing or that kind of stuff is that you can kind of make that determination at that point and say, ‘Hey, my time is worth $20 to $30 an hour right now.’ Right? It is worth my time because I have to pay somebody more than that to do this particular task.

Paula: Droite.

Scott: But as time evolves, maybe that becomes less and less true. My time is now worth maybe a $100 or whatever it is that you kind of judge as time goes on. Now, it is time to hire those things out

and kind of in-source them. I love this thought process of kind of how you can fill up first with the things that cannot be outsourced and then move on to those next things and make a conscious decision about that.

Paula: Right, exactly, exactly. The other piece of it that I often think about is what is more scalable? I came to this crossroads where, as some background, a brief background about my job history. I graduated from college in 2005 and I went to work at a newspaper. My starting salary was $21,000 a year, that was in $2,005 as I like to joke. It is so often I hear people say like, ‘Oh, yes. I also made $21,000 a year starting salary.’ It was in 1975, I am like…

Mindy: Very different $21,000 back in 1975. You could buy a house for that.

Paula: Exactement. I got to say, you can still buy a house for 21,000 these days. It just depends on where.

Mindy: Not in Colorado, not in Denver.

Paula: Well, where and in what condition? You might be able to find some in a, I do not know about Denver property, but maybe in Aurora. I do not know, I have not looked in a while. I have not looked in Colorado in a while. Certainly in the Atlanta area where everybody claims that you cannot meet the 1% rule, there are still $20,000 houses there. It just depends on what neighborhood you are looking at.

Mindy: Oui. Okay, you started as a journalist at $21,000 whopping a year.

Paula: Exactly, exactly. I think this is where a lot of my like penny pinching habits really formed. Like if I forgot to bring lunch to work then rather than buy lunch, I would go to the grocery store and just walk in laps around the isles eating the free samples that people were handing out.

Scott: Oh, man. What was your position like at that point? Did you have like student loans or was that where you kind of…

Paula: No, fortunately I did not have student loans. I had that big advantage going for me as a 21 year old. I do believe that I still could have done everything that I have done if I had had student loans but it would have taken longer, right? That would have been the first hurdle to clear. Fortunately, I did not have to clear that hurdle, but I was starting with a $21,000 salary and I eventually bought a $400 car. When I say that people are like, ‘You mean 400 a month?’ I am like, no, no, no. I mean $400. That was the cost of the car. He wanted four $450 for it that I negotiated down.

Mindy: Did it run?

Paula: It did. It was older than me at the time. It was a 23 year old Toyota. It was in Colorado, I was living in Boulder. It was so rusted through that there were like the body was so rusted through that you could sit inside of the car and reach your hand out of parts of the body and the outside world. In Colorado, as you can imagine, when it snowed I mean it was winter wonderland inside of the car because car is not weatherproof. Anytime it snowed, I was just like sitting on these really wet seats. The seat belt, this is not recommended because this is very dangerous, but the seatbelt had frayed to the point where it no longer existed and it was a four speed manual. I had never driven a stick before so that was the car on which I learned how to drive a stick.

Scott: Where are you living for this? Like what part of Colorado? What city?

Paula: I was in Boulder, Colorado. I lived with a bunch of roommates in an apartment. My share of the rent was $400 a month. Yes, I was fortunately like walking distance to work so I did not actually have to drive that car very often. But I joined the Denver Press Club which met in downtown Denver. For trips like that, sometimes I would take the bus if it was snowy outside but other times I would, I would drive that little rust bucket of a car to these networking events at the Denver Press Club on the hopes that maybe one of these would allow me to escalate up to a high paying job like working at the rocky mountain news, which eventually collapsed.

Scott: What was your like trajectory like over the first… How long did this situation go on?

Paula: Oh, okay. While I was, so this is actually in hindsight, this is how I started to escalate. I mentioned I would go to these networking events at the Denver Press Club and that was where I learned about this organization called The Society of Professional Journalists. I am making $21,000 a year, I saved enough money to pay for myself to go to conferences. They had an annual conference and I would send myself to their conferences, that was me investing in myself and investing in my career. When I was at these conferences and the way that the tracks were broken out was newspaper, magazine, radio, TV, and then they had this track called freelance. I had never heard of that before, that concept.

Out of curiosity, I just started going to popping into some of these conference tracks that were on the freelance track and that was when I discovered at a conceptual level that it was possible to earn money outside of W2 employment. That concept was totally new to me. I had no idea that that was a thing. Once I learned that, I thought that was interesting. I started contacting various journalists in the Denver, Boulder area and inviting them to go out to coffee and just asking them how they got started and from that I started landing my first couple of freelance assignments. Once I started doing that, I was a freelance writer, I was writing for Boulder Women’s magazine for a little bit, I wrote for dining out magazine, I wrote for Awards and Engraving Magazine which is like an industry publication for people in the engraving industry.

I just took whatever I could get but the pay was significantly better. I was making the equivalent of between $50 to $75 an hour doing this freelance work whereas in my normal day job I was making $21,000 a year. I could see very quickly that I had better opportunities for income and better opportunities for “advancements” so to speak through freelance work. By virtue of doing this, really this did two things. Number one, I made extra money that I could save up so that eventually I could quit my job. Number two, by doing this freelance work, I saw that it was possible. While working a day job, developed the confidence to believe that I could it be a full time freelancer. I quit my job in 2008 and at the time that I quit, I was making $31,000 a year.

That is the highest salary that I ever earned as somebody else’s W2 employee. But during those three years, I had also been freelancing, making up to $75 an hour as a freelancer and that was instrumental for both of those reasons that I just named, for the savings that it allowed me to accumulate and for the confidence that it allowed me to build. In 2008 to 2010, I did not really do a whole lot. I traveled, I worked a little. Like I freelanced a little bit but I was not really throwing myself into it. In 2010, that was when I threw myself fully into this idea of I am really going to develop a career out of this. I am really going to go for it. I am going to be a full time freelancer.

From the point at which I started taking it seriously, it took from that point 18 months into the future of that that I actually started making six figures as a freelancer, which is mind blowing. Take this kid from who had been making $21,000 a year, driving a $400 car, to now making six figures self-employed, that was mind blowing. To me that was proof of concept of the power of self-employment, the power of entrepreneurship.

Mindy: What I find interesting is that you quit your job in 2008, I do not know if you know this, but there are some things going on in the world and quitting a job in 2008 was not necessarily the smartest move from somebody looking outward on your choices. How much money had you saved up? Because you said you did not really like throw yourself into the freelancing for a couple of years and I know a little bit about your story. I know enough that you were traveling. Where were you traveling? How much money did you have? How much money did you did you like had saved up for this? Like did you ever feel a sense of like impending doom? Oh my goodness, where is my next? What am I going to do for money? Because those are all the questions that I get on a regular basis. I cannot quit my job because what happens if.

Paula: I had about $25,000 at the time that I quit my job. I went to countries where the dollar exchange rate really worked in my favor. Egypt, India, Cambodia, Laos, those are places where the US dollar goes a lot further. I still in, even now in the back of my mind, I always know like alright, if I am in trouble, if things get rough, I can always go to a nation where the dollar exchange rate works in my favor. Maybe I cannot live there forever. But if things get rough and I need to cash up, I will go to Vientiene, Laos and spend six months there. That is always an option and there is a certain psychological relief that comes from knowing that that possibility of out there.

I know that for the people who are listening to this, that might sound intimidating, but things are only intimidating if you have not done them before. Yes, that is true if buying rental properties, that is true if starting your own business. That is true of spending three months in Gola or in Carola or some part of the world where the dollar just goes a lot further in Myanmar.

Mindy: This is something that Kristy and Bryce said in episode 55. They do the same thing. When something happens to their portfolio, they just look at where they want to be. Okay, we really like Thailand, let us go there for a few months.

Paula: Yes, exactly, exactly.

Scott: What brought you back to United States?

Paula: I just wanted to be back. You know what I missed that I did not expect to miss? I missed Costco. I got to the point where I just really missed Costco and I missed having a water kettle from which I could make my own tea and I wanted a cat. Like those little comforts of having an established home rather than constantly hopping from guest to guest house. That was what I wanted by the time I came back.

Scott: When was that? What year was that?

Paula: That was 2010.

Scott: 2010, okay. Kind of what is your situation look like once you moved back to the states?

Paula: I moved to Atlanta and I did very, very briefly work at another company for a few months but my heart was not really in it. I really wanted to freelance. I left that company and began freelancing. For a long time… I started out work writing these articles for ehow.com that paid $15 an article. My goal is to see if I could write three articles in an hour which tells you something about the quality of my work but I usually could not get it to that much but I was able to pretty consistently get myself up to two articles an hour. That ended up being 30 bucks an hour. Then I got my quote unquote big break which was I got hired about.com and they put me on a contract that paid $800 a month. Then I was like, whew, I have got some stable income coming in, $800 a month. I was living as one of five people in a three bedroom apartment. My personal individual share of that rent was $200 a month. That is where I was in 2010.

Scott: How much do they charge for cat rent?

Paula: The landlord charged like a $250 cat fee but I never told him about the cat. Then upon move out, it turned out that he knew about it anyway because he would come by to mow the lawn and he would see the cat in the window so he knew about the cat and he was nice enough to just not charge the fee.

Scott: Fair enough.

Paula: I think if I had been a problem tenant or if we had been problem tenants, he might have enforced it but he was willing to look the other way.

Scott: Was Costco everything that you remembered it to be?

Paula: Ah, a place where you can get huge bag of organic frozen blueberries for $9. I mean that is worth coming back to the United States for.

Scott: One of the things I want to point out here about this is that throughout this entire timeline, your entire adult life up to this point, you have really done an effective job at keeping your housing expense to a bare minimum which is kind of I think allowed for the freedom to do some of this stuff, right? Whereas I presume some of your peers were probably just moving into fancy places or nice homes or buying their first house and all that kind of stuff. You are living with roommates at very cheap rates, I presume, that is enabling you to pursue these adventures and confront.

Paula: That is a good observation. I would say that the number one thing that I did throughout my entire 20’s that assisted in my financial success is live with roommates. I lived with roommates until I was 31 and by the time I stopped living with roommates, I was married and I had a net worth of more than a million dollars. I was still living with roommates, I kept that habit up, after marriage, after hitting seven figures status. I still maintained that habit until the age of 31. Yes.

Scott: I think it is a critical point. I think if you had not done that, you had not done that, you would have needed to pursue a more stable source of income.

Paula: Exactement.

Scott: That would have prevented you from experimenting in some of these ways and all that kind of stuff. Sorry, you are at the $800 a month, you just hit the lottery and sort of that. What happens next?

Scott: I think you hit the nail on the head when you said I would have needed a more stable source of income. I think you are absolutely right. If I had needed to pay $1,200 a month for rent rather than $200, yes, I would have needed a more stable source of income. I would have traditional W2 employment. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but for me and my story, particularly in the field that I was in which was journalism, like that was not going to be my ticket to extreme success. Now, as for the people who are listening to this, sure, if you are an anesthesiologist, keep your day job. That is going to make more there than you will writing for ehow.com. But for my field and for the work that I was doing, let me put it this way, the newspaper that I worked at from 2005 to 2008, the highest paid person in the company was earning around $60,000 a year, the managing editor.

I knew that I was never going to make six figures there because nobody in the entire company was making six figures other than possibly, I do not know what the owner was making, but none of the employees were making that. It was clear, at least in my situation, that self-employment was going to be the way to go and keeping my cost of living low, particularly my housing costs as you mentioned, was going to be the key to that. There are so many people who I talk to now who are like, ‘I cannot because of X,’ and it will be, ‘Oh, because I am married’ or even ‘Oh, because I have kids.’ But I have plenty of friends with kids who still live with roommates and to be honest, most of them are doing it out of necessity.

They would not prefer to be doing it, but they do not have, financially speaking, another option. They do it because they have to. I very strongly want to send that message. There is a difference between cannot versus choose not to and never conflate those two. Do not confuse those two. There are a lot of people who can do things that you yourself believe that you cannot.

Mindy: Yes, what is that quote? You are capable of more than you could possibly think. Yes, you could do it. I could have roommates right now, I choose not to. But instead of having a great big giant house, I have a small house. I do not have a tiny house, I have a small house and that is okay. My mortgage payment is $1,100 a month and I really like having a small mortgage payment. I choose, I d I do it different. I do not have the great big house, I have the small one instead but same general concept. My housing costs are very low. Do not forget your transportation costs were also very low with your one-time fee of $400.

Paula: Exactement.

Mindy: For the pre-air conditioned car.

Paula: That is a great way of describing it.

Scott: Oui.

Mindy: Oui.

Scott: I think the lesson that I am taking away though is that you want to make it big like Paula Pant, you got to put it in the dues with the low lifestyle expenses for as long as it takes to kind of get yourself, get your foundation set in a scalable income path, right?

Paula: Droite.

Scott: That scalable income always comes with uncertainty, right?

Paula: Droite.

Scott: Almost every single circumstance, unless you become a doctor, in which case it becomes with nine years of or whatever you want. Med school and residency.

Mindy: Really long time.

Paula: Right, right.

Mindy: D'accord.

Paula: That said though, part of the takeaway is yes, the frugality, keeping your expenses, particularly your housing costs and other fixed costs. Keeping those low can definitely create the parameters that allow for success but that being said, as I just mentioned, I have a lot of friends who have a very very cheap lifestyle and they are not making six figure incomes or building seven figure portfolios, right? Like frugality is necessary but not sufficient. It is that combination of living as cheaply as possible while also escalating your earnings and focusing on the income side. It is that one, two, punch. You can think of it as a sports metaphor, playing defense and playing off fence, right? I have a lot of friends who play a very strong defense. They are living very frugally but they are also not making much and they have, at this point in their lives, no sign that they will ever make more.

That super frugal lifestyle alone is not going to help them advance.

Mindy: Let us go to 2010 when you decided that you were going to focus more on your freelancing and your generating income based on the articles that you are making. It does not sound like you stayed writing for ehow for $15 an article cause that is not really necessarily scalable. How did you scale?

Paula: In 2011, I started a blog. Then in 2015 or 2016, sometime after that, I started a podcast and the brand is called Afford Anything. It is AffordAnything.com. That on a parallel track also began over time to develop an audience and you develop the blog, develop their readership and then the podcast, develop the listenership. I kind of had these two parallel businesses that were going both at the same time. One in which I was a freelance writer and I was writing for mostly various online websites. I wrote for AOL Daily Finance and I wrote for JemStep.com which was a registered investment advisor based out at Silicon Valley. I wrote a bunch of… Wrote and edited a lot of blog articles for them.

I wrote for a company called BillGuard. Like I just accumulated a lot of clients that needed writing for their websites whether it was a startup that needed somebody to write for its blog or whether it was a more traditional sort of news outlet sort of thing. I developed a freelance writing career. That was this one business that I had. I called it Catalyst Digital Marketing. I eventually realized that in addition to actually writing the blog articles, I can serve my clients better if I also offered to manage their editorial calendar and to do their social media posting.

I kind of escalated from “just being a freelance writer” to offering full service digital marketing services. Hey, I am not just going to write your blog posts, I will also manage your whole content calendar. You do not have to worry about it because you are a brand new startup. Just outsource your content calendar to me and my team and we will handle it and it will cost you $3,000 a month, right? I scaled the business to that and once you are doing that and you are serving multiple clients and those clients all have funding and they have got backing and they can pay $3,000 a month to just hand all of their content management to you. Well, hey, guess what? Now you have got a six figure business doing content management for all of these companies and that is awesome. I was doing that and that was this one business that I had…

Scott: How long did it take to get from start to six figures? I am sorry to…

Paula: 18 months from the time I started taking it seriously, 18 months. I was doing it kind of a little bit without taking it very seriously for five years before that. But from actually taking it seriously, 18 months.

Scott: D'accord.

Paula: I will say approximately 18 months. I do not mean like 18 to the day but I remember there were these two particular clients that I landed, one paid $3,000 a month and the other paid $2,000 a month and both of those contracts hit almost exactly the same time. Those two contracts, $5,000 a month, in addition to the about five-ish that I was already making, that was the moment. That was a first time that I ever experienced a five figure gross revenue month and that was an eye opener for me. Like that was such a game-changer that something like that was possible for someone who used to make $21,000 a year.

Mindy: How much time were you spending doing this? Did your six figure income come from 60 hour work weeks? 80 hour workweeks?

Paula: Oh, yes, all the time. I was a stressed out basket case. That was when I was really going through a lot of my mental looping around what is my time worth because I could not let go of the identity of the person who made $21,000 a year and that has always been one of my big financial struggles, it is still is. Your image of yourself is often lags the current reality of yourself because your image of yourself was formed from the several previous years and those several previous years are a lagging or trailing indicator of your current situation. But it is hard to mentally catch up.

That first five figure month that I had, that first month that my gross revenue tops $10,000, I still had this image of myself as somebody who made $30,000 a year. I was just burning the candle at every end because here I am running this business and then also trying to grow a blog and then also driving to five different grocery stores because bananas are cheaper at one and milk is cheaper at the other and I am refusing to outsource any of the logistics of my daily life.

To be honest, it was exhausting. If I could do it again, I would have valued my time more but really at the core of that, that means that I would have had more confidence. Because when you are not truly confident about your ability to earn, then even when you are doing well, you kind of think, well, this success that I am having at the moment, this is just a fluke or this is just momentary. This is not going to last so I need a clutch on to every penny for as long as I can, as hard as I can and as much as I can because this is just a fluke and I have got big imposter syndrome and any moment now this is all going to go away.

Yes, I mean if I could do it over again I would have just been more confident and the decisions that would have stemmed from that would have reflected it. In terms of like a timeline and years, how long did this kind of state continue for? When did you get those two contracts and how long did this kind of like hustle and bustle of like, yes, you are earning good money but also really stressed out on every front. How long did that go on?

Paula: I landed those two contracts, the $2,000 and $3,000 contract in late 2012. That hustle and bustle probably from 2012 to 2015, those were really hard years, constantly stressed out years. I remember, there is this conference all three of us all go to called FinCon and I remember being at FinCon and this must have been approximately 2015 and I was at the point where I was not really monetizing the blog very much and I knew that it had potential and I knew that it was more scalable than this content marketing business that I was running. That if I, realistically I could not do them both. At that point, I had been running my blog for about four years. I had always wanted a podcast but had not started one yet. I was thinking to myself, if I could just kill this content marketing company, I would have enough time to focus on Afford Anything.

But at the same time, as we discussed earlier in this podcast, I also, to be honest with myself, saw all of the inefficiencies in my life. I saw all of the times that it took me 10 minutes to wash my face at night or all of the times that I would be cleaning up and I would pick up an old book or an odd magazine and then I would absent-mindedly flipped through it and 10 minutes or 15 minutes would go by. Like to be totally honest with myself, I saw all of those and I just thought I should not have to kill both businesses. If only I were more productive, if only I were more efficient, if only I could make more efficient trips to the grocery store instead of mindlessly wandering the aisles, then I could do them both. I remember talking to this guy by the name of Leslie Samuel at FinCon. FinCon had just ended.

It was like a Sunday morning or Sunday afternoon. We were all sitting in a hallway of the hotel waiting for transportation back to the airport. I was telling him this, I was telling him like, ‘I have got the six figure business and then I have got this other brand that has potential and I want to do them both and I believe that I can do them both and I just need to be a more productive, more efficient person.’ He just looked me straight in the eye and he said, ‘How long have you been telling yourself that?’ Yes, right, that just hit me. As soon as he said that, I knew what I had to do. From that point forward, I began at the very slow process of dismantling my content marketing business and what that looked like in reality, it was not a one and done deal. It was the process of gradually dropping clients over time. It probably took me about two years to just drop slowly, drop clients and move my focus over to building this other brand that more scalable.

Scott: During this period… Sorry, I am like… This is a great… My mind is going on a different topic right now. What are you doing with your assets? Because I remember, I know you were investing in real estate during this period as well.

Paula: Oui.

Scott: What were you kind of doing from your other financial position while you were earning and saving and hustle bustle in these in these years?

Paula: From the money that I was making, because I was still living very cheaply, I was saving a lot. Those assets went into a combination of real estate investments as well as 401K and IRA contributions. Every year, and I guess most remembered or most known for my real estate investments, I think because to a lot of people that is unique. Now, I understand in the BiggerPockets community, there is nothing particularly unique or special or different about buying some rental properties like, ‘Welcome to the club, you are one of many people who have done it.’ But in mainstream society context, to a lot of people I was the only person that they knew who owned rental properties or the only person that they knew who was investing in real estate.

For some reason, that is what a lot of people seem to associate me with or what people remember me for or know me for. But the actual numbers of it, you know real estate was just one of many slices of the pie. I also had a Roth Solo 401k and I maxed that out every year. That was at the time that I started at $18,000 a year. Now, in 2019, that is $19,000 a year. I also had a Roth IRA, at the time that I started, you could max that out at $5,000 a year. Now, it is $6,000 a year. Now, I can no longer do a Roth, I can do a backdoor Roth contribution. I do that, I max that out every year. I have an HSA, that is another $3,400 a year.

Then of course because I run my own business, there is the employer side of what myself, as my own employer, can contribute to my 401K. That is 25% of some complicated calculation, 25% of the very complicated IRS calculation of what my “compensation” is. I was doing all of those things as well and that is also a huge part of my net worth and that does not generate the same level of attention as my rental property investments. I think, I do not know, I have many theories about this. Partially because rental properties are more unique or different.

Partially also because rental properties are tangible. You can take pictures of them, you can post data about them like it is this many bedrooms and this many bathrooms and I bought it for this much like. It is more of a talking point than, ‘Hey, I maxed out my 401k this year.’ But that does not mean that it is any more or less important. Like your 401k, your IRA, your HSA, those are still massively important and there is a huge part of my portfolio.

Scott: No, I think that that is a fantastic answer. I think what I am trying to get at is just how you thinking about asset management and portfolio design and all that kind of stuff as you are going through this period of earning a lot of money. It sounds like your approach is I want to be efficient in every area. I am going to take advantage of all my tax advantage accounts first and then I am going to do HSA, getting tax advantage and all that kind of stuff. Then I am going to have this pile of cash leftover and rental properties as one of several efficient things I can do with this large surplus of cash. I am going would accumulate a bunch of this. Is that the right way to understand it?

Paula: Absolutely, that is spot on, yes.

Scott: I think that a lot of folks that are listening to BiggerPockets in the show, you think hey, the real estate is the central part of the portfolio, right? Well, I am the same way as you Paula. Real estate is one important part of my portfolio but one of many parts, right?

Paula: Droite.

Scott: That is going on in my overall wealth building plan. I think that is true of most real estate investors, right? Very few people that I have talked only or have the vast majority of their net worth only in real estate. It is about the output of the financial freedom and flexibility, not about which specific path you go down.

Paula: Right, right. Exactement. In the world of traditional retirement planning, people often talk about traditional retirement. We are talking about retirement age 59 and a half plus. They talk about it in terms of the three legged stool which was your tax advantage retirement accounts as one leg of that stool, your social security as the other leg, and then any pension that you might receive as the other leg.

Financial planners often talk about this three legged stool. Well, for us, for you and me and probably a lot of the people who are listening to this podcast, that is a multi-legged stool that consists of real estate and also tax advantage retirement accounts and also maybe some other businesses that you own that are a source of passive or semi passive income and also your mentality. The fact that you embrace the flexibility of I am just going to go spend rent out my primary home and spend six months in Medellin, Columbia if things go bad or if it were a tough state. I think that that combination of all of the above is what creates true security.

Mindy: D'accord. I am going to go back to this. Just a moment ago you said, ‘I do not know why everybody associates me with real estate so much because there is so many other things.’ I know exactly why people associate you with real estate. It is because you are a woman and women do not invest in real estate according to I do not know what but there is this overwhelming feeling that women do not invest in real estate and I get questions all the time and people send me notes all the time, ‘It is so nice to hear from you, another woman who invested in real estate.’ The BiggerPockets membership skews totally male. To see somebody who not only is a real estate investor, but a successful real estate investor and female is different. It is odd, it is the yellow sock or whatever.

The pink sock and the red sock in the white load, it stands out because it is different. I want to say that you can be a successful female real estate investor. Look, here is one right… Here is two, 66% of the people on this podcast are successful female real estate investors. 100% of the people on this podcast are successful real estate investors. But also, real estate has this aura where you buy a property and you are instantly a millionaire. That is not necessarily true but it is a lot sexier than, ‘Oh, I maxed out my 401k,’ like you said earlier. That is not so exciting and real estate is very exciting. I think that is why it really sticks with you but also like you are successful real estate investor and there is a lot of people who lose money doing it because they do not do it right.

Paula: Droite.

Mindy: How many properties do you own?

Paula: Between myself and Will, we have seven rental units plus a primary residence.

Mindy: D'accord. Does that, does the income from your rental units cover what you need to live?

Paula: In 2017 the rental units grossed $125,000 and netted $43,000 after all expenses, including debt servicing and all other operating costs.

Mindy: D'accord. You are around there, are you comfortable saying how much you spend?

Paula: I mean how much I spend is kind of a moving target.

Mindy: D'accord.

Paula: I would consider myself financially independent because $43,000 is, well first of all, that is only the cash flow for my rental properties. That does not include the size of my other portfolio, right? Just putting it out there. As of July of 2018, between myself and Will combined, our combined portfolio was around 2.2 million. That includes equity in the rental properties as well as all 401k, all other investment assets. About 1.1 million per person is, regardless of cash flow from rental properties, like that is… If I am 35 and healthy and I cannot figure it out on $1 million, I have got some problems.

Mindy: I am glad you said that, I totally agree. But with the cash flow just from the rental property, I am married and have two kids and a fairly frugal-ish, we spend around $40,000 a year. I am assuming that you, in your situation, in your life, you would be able to live off of $40,000 a year.

Paula: Yes, there is no reason why I would not be able to live on $40,000 a year.

Mindy: Well, sure there is. You could have a big house and a big car and a brand new cell phone with an expensive cell plan and all the clothes you want and thousand dollar makeup jobs and all that stuff.

Paula: People pay a thousand for a makeup job?

Mindy: I do not know, clearly, clearly I do not know.

Paula: I drive an 11 year old Honda civic and I live in a two bedroom condo, 1600 square feet which is to be honest, that is really big for my needs. I could live in half of this size.

Scott: I love this discussion. It is like a compound effect of how do I maximize my income, how do I keep my expenses reasonable and then they will grow over time as your financial position. The point of this is to live a comfortable life on your terms exactly as you want, right? Then we are going to have a holistic approach to wealth management from there. Where do you kind of think once you wound down that business, like what was kind of the output of that exercise of kind of getting your priorities figured out from a business and financial perspective? What did the situation look like maybe a couple of years following that crucial discussion at FinCon?

Paula: Fortunately, the risk that I took paid off and it was a risk but when I wound down my content marketing business, I put more and more time into developing our Afford Anything and both the blog and the podcast. That has paid off. I have run the Afford Anything podcast for about three years now. Last year, I am just throwing all the numbers out there, I want to explain to the audience like this is not me. The reason that I am doing this is that I hope that this added transparency will provide an educational component.

Mindy: It is the opening the Kimono.

Paula: Oh, that is a visual.

Mindy: Show us what is under your Kimono. This is not you bragging, I made $14 off my podcast last year. Like that is not you bragging about this, this is look what I can do, look what I did as a self-employed person. Maybe somebody is not going to start another podcast, but maybe they do I could do this and I could take my passion and put it this way. You never know what is going to inspire, so please please share. This is an inspirational share.

Paula: Good, good. Excellent. Last year, Afford Anything, the entire brand of Afford Anything. The blog, the podcast, the YouTube Channel, the whole soup of it grossed $285,000 and netted a $113,000 after expenses. I say that because I want to communicate to people. A lot of people have…Basically I want to clear up misconceptions. Number one, a lot of people have this misconception that the majority of my money comes from the cash flow from rental properties. I do not know why people think that, it does not. I am going to stay flat out that it does not, but still and I have said that many many times and yet people seem to continue to think it anyway. I do not know why, I really do not know why so many people place more emphasis on the rentals than I think is…

Scott: They are one meaningful contributor to your overall income, right?

Paula: Exactly, exactly.

Scott: They are not insignificant but they are definitely not the whole show it sounds like.

Paula: Exactly, exactly, exactly. I think probably a lot of rental investors who are listening to this are probably nodding their heads because I imagine many people in the audience have the same experience where you are a multifaceted entrepreneur and investor and you do a lot of things and some of those things are headline grabbers, some of those things are tangible and visceral like a house, and those are the things that people tend to remember but really it is one of many. It is one slice of a bigger pie, so maybe BiggerPockets should be called BiggerPies.

Scott: Yes, but it is about bigger pockets, it is not just about real estate, right?

Paula: Oh oui.

Scott: All facets of wealth creation, right? Here on the money show, we are not focusing on real estate because it is about the personal financial position and moves toward financial freedom. Now, that said, probably most of you listening have real estate as an interest in one component or the other of your overall plan.

Paula: Yes, you are right. BiggerPockets is a perfect analogy because you can put multiple things inside of your pocket. But yes, but I say that also because a lot of people have the impression and I can see this when I go to cocktail parties and somebody says, what do you do? I say, ‘I am a podcaster.’ Everyone is like, ‘Pfff, can you make money or that?’ I do want to communicate to people that, yes, there are opportunities to make good money online and particularly if you, as I started off, if you are in the type of industry or have the type of profession where you do not realistically see yourself making a six figure income in the next five years, then you might be able to make more striking it out on your own and developing an online business and you can make good money doing that.

Scott: I love that point. That, I think, is critical. Is assessing the reality of your current career track, right? Because when I was at my first job, I was making $48,000 a year, which is much better than $21,000 a year, but still the career path was not going to get me to where I wanted it to go. I knew that the best I could hope for in about 10 years was to become a director, making around $110,000. I was like that is not an acceptable best case scenario for what I am trying to do. How do I go along in another career track that has more scalable opportunity there? I think this is a really important point for people who are not in love with their current job. If you love your job, there is a lot of good jobs up there that are not going to have a huge income but have a really rewarding experience, that is one thing. But if you do not love your job and there is no career potential, like why are you not coming up with a plan of action to move on to a different thing? Pas immédiatement. Do not quit tomorrow with no plan, but over the next six months to a year.

Paula: Oui absolument. Absolument.

Mindy: Oui. I know multiple people, as to you Paula, as to you Scott, who make six figures or very high five figures a month on their online business and I am going to say they did not whip up their website today and tomorrow they are pulling in five figures. It does take time, it takes quality content. Over and over, you hear content is king. Are you making boring content on your podcast, Paula? Nan.

Paula: I hope not.

Mindy: I am going to go and I am going to bring her in to this conversation. Did not you just interview somebody that went ridiculously viral because of the content? A little podcast called, what episode number was it, 153?

Paula: Ah, the Suze Orman.

Mindy: Yes, the Suze Orman. Yes, this was so difficult to listen to. When I was hearing her, I am like I have to admire your poise and your restraint because I am not the same kind of interviewer that you are and I would have been like what are you talking about Suze? Yes, you can do this. I am living proof you can do this. What are you talking about? Every single thing she said, it was like no. Then she contradicted herself and that was a very very powerful interview because you gave her all of this rope to hang herself and she just kept taking it from you. But that went crazy and it did not go crazy just because of what she was saying. It went crazy because of the way that you were allowing her to say it. That takes skill and that is never something I could have pulled off and that was a really great content interview as well.

Paula: Ah, thank you. Merci beaucoup.

Mindy: I really loved that. That was… Like I loved it and I hated it and that went crazy in a lot of different ways but it was also really really good information and here is a counterpoint to what all these other people are talking about and every single one of her points could be shut down pretty easily. I did not want a private island.

Scott: For those of you who are maybe not familiar with the podcast, right? This is episode 153 of Afford Anything featuring Suze Orman.

Paula: Suze Orman has written nine books, I believe. Her latest book is called Women and Money, but she is best known for being the host of the Suze Orman Show.

Scott: Oh, that is right. Suze basically says hey, I hate the FIRE movement because you really need five, ten, thirty million before you can feel comfortable retiring early, right?

Mindy: I hate it, I hate it, I hate it is the exact quote.

Scott: Interesting perspective that I think a lot of us that are working on and the FIRE movement and all this kind of stuff, talk about money, would disagree with a lot of her points but it was an interesting different perspective and I think it was a great listen. To Mindy’s great point, you do a fantastic job, Paula, of hosting the interview and asking great questions and making it clear I do not agree necessarily with these things. My job is to interview her.

Paula: Je vous remercie.

Scott: Yes, go ahead and listen to that show.

Paula: Je vous remercie. Je vous remercie.

Mindy: Oui. There were follow up shows. But what the point I am trying to make is you need to make good content in order to make money off of your online business. First, be interesting. You can have a blog, you can have a podcast, and if nobody listens and nobody reads and it does not really matter, you are not going to make very much money off of that. It will be interesting.

Paula: This circles back perfectly to what we were talking about at the beginning of this interview, which is writing from a place of inspiration and authenticity. Not just writing for the keywords or the search strings or surveying your audience and writing whatever they want you to say. If writing is the physical manifestation of your thoughts and feelings, then what is going to emerge is going to be much higher quality than something that have tried to do in a formulaic way.

Scott: Aimer.

Mindy: Parfait.

Scott: You do not get… You do not get… You do not stir up a debate of a lot of questions if you are writing about something that do you think is going to be the key word of the day. You get that when you write about something that people disagree with strongly with you and you have a point that you want to defend justice strongly on whatever it is, right?

Paula: Droite. If you have a message, if you have a philosophy, if you have an idea that is worth spreading to borrow from the TED Talk slogan, that is how you get noticed. I should say also for the people who are listening, any type of an online business, it does not have to be a blog or a podcast necessarily, whatever it is that you are doing. If you are selling windshield wipers on Amazon, if you are selling candles on Etsy, whatever it is that you are doing. If you are selling… If you are a teacher and you are selling lesson plans, no matter what, be the best. Like if you deliver quality, if you deliver value, then it will take a while. It is not going to be 10 years to overnight success, but over time, people will recognize that value.

Scott: Oui.

Mindy: Yes, I love it. J'aime cela.

Scott: Is there anything else about your story that you want to cover before we begin kind of transitioning to the Famous Four here?

Paula: I think we have done it.

Mindy: D'accord. It is now time for our Famous Four questions. These are the same five questions we ask all of our guests, four questions and a demand. Up first, what is your favorite finance book?

Paula: Strictly speaking, this is not a financial book, but Seven Habits of Highly Effective People by Stephen Covey. It is one of the books that I go back to at least once a year and re-read. The most important piece of it, I mean I get new pieces from it every time I re-read it, but one of the most important pieces of this book is when he talks about your circle of influence versus your circle of concern. Essentially, he talks about the importance of maintaining a locus of control. I highly recommend that book to everybody. Do not get it from the library. Buy it so that that way you can take notes and you can mark it up and you can go back and re-read it or re-read sections of it over and over and over again.

Scott: Yes, love it. I mean that has been a perennial best seller for a very long time, for a very good reason. I have not read it in a couple of years, maybe almost eight years now. I am going to go back and re-read it as well.

Paula: Impressionnant.

Scott: Bien. What was your biggest money mistake?

Paula: Actually, it was fake frugality. It was what we were talking about earlier. It was getting so stuck in this mindset that I have to do everything myself and I have to say yes to every income producing opportunity, every gig, every new job, no matter how well or how poorly it pays. Say yes to every article that is offered to me, say yes to everything like because I was afraid, really I had a scarcity mindset, and I was afraid that there was not going to be enough. That often what you fear is what you manifest. The fear that there will not be enough and sometimes lead you to making decisions that inhibit your growth, thereby resulting in less.

Scott: Impressionnant.

Mindy: Parfait. What is your best piece of advice for people who are just starting out?

Paula: I would suggest what I call growing the gap. People often get caught up in this debate over is it more important to earn more or spend less? Which side should I focus on, the earning side or the saving side? My compromise, compromise is not really the right word, when you take a step back and you ask what is the actual objective here? What are we trying to do? What we are trying to do is increase the gap, grow the gap between what you make and what you spend. Of course, there are only two ways to increase that gap, earn more or spend less or some combination of both. But at the end of the day, what is important is not to pick a side like it is a sports team. I am on the earning camp, or I am on the saving camp. What matters is the size of that gap.

Scott: Aimer. Yes, I would not even… I will throw in there as well as what are the piece there. It is about creating passive income, right?

Paula: Droite.

Scott: You can earn more, spend less or you can create a blog or an asset, right? Focus your time on that kind of stuff as well, right? I just think, yes, there is no reason to choose sides. It is how do I optimize every part of the funnel, spend less, earn more, income or asset allocation, all that kind of stuff. J'aime ça.

Paula: Droite.

Mindy: That is the best answer to that which side of the… Which teams should I take? That is the best answer I have ever heard.

Paula: Merci merci.

Mindy: I love that a lot.

Scott: Oui. Okay, what is your favorite joke to tell at parties? This is the most difficult question of Famous Four.

Paula: Bien. What did the caveman say when his suit got altered really fast?

Scott: I do not know. Quoi?

Paula: Taylor swift.

Mindy: Oh mon Dieu. Throwing that out to JD Roth, the big Taylor Swift fan. Jim Lang I believe is also a big TS fan.

Paula: Mr. Money Mustache, also a big Taylor Swift fan. Lots of people in the fire community, big Taylor swift fans.

Scott: Well, actually today, a bunch of companies are re-branding. You got a good point about how BiggerPockets could have more money coming in there. We are actually re-branding to WidePockets. I think JD, his site Get Rich Slowly, I think he is re-branding that to Get Rich Swiftly to go along.

Scott: Yes, still out there.

Mindy: It is Taylor’s face on the turtle? Okay, our last, it is not a question. It is a command. Tell me where people can find out more about you.

Paula: I am the host of the Afford Anything podcast. You can download that anywhere that you listened to podcasts and I suggest hitting the subscribe button so you do not miss any of our awesome episodes. I also have a blog, @affordanything.com, and a free ebook @affordanything.com /escape. It is a 77 page eBook all about escaping the nine to five and designing your lifestyle in a way that in a way that you want to, but in a way that is also money smart.

Mindy: Impressionnant. We will include links to all of these in the show notes for this episode, which is found at biggerpockets.com/moneyshow66. That is biggerpockets.com/moneyshow66. Paula, this was fabulous. Thank you for taking the time out of your day to share all of this amazing stuff with us. I do not even know what I am going to call this episode. Absolutely Everything with Paula Pant.

Paula: Aw, thank you. I learned like 17 things, things I need to do, books I need to read. This has personally been very very helpful.

Paula: That is good. We have covered so much ground with habits and productivity and morning routines and that very very important piece that we talked about at the end of that I think a lot of people can relate to. That real estate is one of many things that I do, but it is one of many items in my very large pocket.

Mindy: In your wide pocket, line them up.

Paula: Gigantic pockets.

Mindy: Let us see if that one is available. We better get to it before this airs otherwise it will not be available anymore. Okay, we are going to get out of here. Thanks again, Paula. Have a great day.

Paula: You too.

Mindy: Okay, we will talk to you soon.

Scott: Bye.

Paula: Bye.

Scott: Alright, that was Paula Pant from Afford Anything. Mindy, what did you think?

Mindy: Oh mon Dieu. I just did not learn a thing, terrible show. It is not something I can say about this episode because it was amazing. I Love Paula’s story. I love her mindset. Just I am thinking everything she is saying, I am like, I should be doing that. I should be doing that. I need to do that too. I need to read that book. I have never read that book. I have been meaning to. Like just over and over, everything she says. I am like, yes, I need to be more like Paula.

Scott: Yes, I think she has a really good perspective that we have not gotten before. Like I think a lot of maybe the listeners of this show can really relate to like fake frugality, right? How many times, I know I have done this in the past where I have just tried to over optimize something that just was not really meaningful and it was a waste of time, right? It seems like such an obvious concept but it is probably something that a lot of people can relate to you here and that it really is a time suck if you are trying to be too productive and to over optimize and every category where it does not really matter.

Mindy: What I find myself doing when I am trying to be really productive is sometimes I catch myself just being busy and that is not the same thing. I took what, 97 tips from Paula today that I can implement the journaling. I just sit there and drink my coffee. I mean like check my email or Twitter or whatever but I could be writing down what I am grateful for and I do not think about it enough. What I am grateful for? The health of my children is just I really take that for granted and I need to stop. I have got really great kids, I have got a really great marriage, I have got a really great life. I need to be more focused on what I am thankful for and I love that gratitude journal. That, from the very beginning of the show, I am like that is starting tomorrow.

Scott: Oui. I think that relationships and gratitude are just central to overall well-being and that kind of stuff. It is so easy and it takes a little time to write things to say. I am grateful for this, this, and this. It is a way better way to start your day. I think there is just like that positivity helps with other things. Very simple thing. Like on my sheet, I have got my three goals and then the first thing I do before I start working on those goals, I write down three things I am grateful for. Then I start making progress towards my kind of like most important actions for the day.

Mindy: Oui. We are going to have that sheet in the show notes at biggerpockets.com/…

Scott: Widerpockets.com.

Mindy: Widerpockets.com/moneyshow66 or the old one will probably still work. BiggerPockets.com/moneyshow66 where we will link to Scott’s document. You can take it and make it your own, you can take it and use it exactly how Scott does. You could be like Scott, but I mean that I think you hit the nail right on the head. Starting off your day with a delicious cup of coffee and a list of things you are grateful for cannot make your day suck.

Scott: Oui. I think it is just kind of funny little tip that Paul and I share in terms of how we kind of start our day and go about things. I think it does make a difference over time.

Mindy: Well, I kid you about your age but you are super super smart and very successful and I have to say that at least some of this is attributable to keeping your goals and writing down your goals and keeping them forefront in your mind and with so much going on in the world, it is so easy to forget about one thing that you were supposed to do and then you are like, oh crap.

Scott: Oui. It is never a time commitment, it is not really a time factor to make that progress is what you call is literally the phone call or the simple action needs to take that just has to get done.

Mindy: Oui.

Scott: Anyway, should we get out of here?

Mindy: We should. From episode 66 of the BiggerPockets Money podcast… From episode 66 of the WiderPockets Money podcast. This is Mr. Scott Trench and Mindy Jensen and do we are gone.

Scott: Bye Bye.

Mindy: Bye.

Scott: Yes, April fools. We are obviously not re-branding as WiderPockets,

Mindy: Although, do we still have that link up? BiggerPocketslove?

Scott: No, that link now do not work in any of that.

Mindy: The links do not work, but the article is still there. The article is hilarious. A few years ago, Scott wrote an article about a for April Fool’s Day called BiggerPockets Love where he pretended we were going to start a dating service because who wants a cashflow negative spouse?

Scott: Back in the early couple of year, real estate aspirations, I think.

Mindy: Oui. Or your financial independence aspirations. The cash flow negative spouse, not the best choice. Yes, we will link to that in the show notes too. It is very funny read. You should read it. Okay, now for real, let us get out of here. Bye, Scott.

Scott: Bye bye.